# Are Super Bowl Commercials Worth the Price? | Knotch x VaynerX Event

## Метаданные

- **Канал:** Gary Vaynerchuk
- **YouTube:** https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WT5KSSIPWkc
- **Дата:** 13.02.2019
- **Длительность:** 1:04:58
- **Просмотры:** 31,732
- **Источник:** https://ekstraktznaniy.ru/video/17993

## Описание

Today’s video is a heavy marketing episode where we talk about super bowl commercials.

I sit down with moderator Laura Molen from NBC U and panelists Stacy Taffet from PepsiCo and Anda Gansca from Knotch to discuss the effectiveness of Super Bowl commercials, attention arbitrage, and more.

You guys will enjoy this one ;) I get deep into marketing and business tactics 

Special thanks to Knotch for collaborating with me and my team! Check out their website here: https://www.knotch.it/

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## Транскрипт

### Segment 1 (00:00 - 05:00) []

Super Bowl ads one final point Gary buy them you got your perspective what's up guys this is a fun conversation we had the day after the Super Bowl in New York City with some great people from Pepsi and notch and MBC you super excited about the conversation very macro branding TV stuff that I think is a different look for some of you but there's some damat ik senate that could be unbelievably valuable so some thoughtful branding and marketing talk hope you enjoy it despite any controversies advertisers are flocking to the Superbowl to get their brand messages across it's reported that CBS made 382 million dollars at 5 million per 30-second ad and it's not surprising because three out of four people say they look forward to the Superbowl ads and research shows that memorability for brands in the Super Bowl are 54% higher than regular television norms so it's really a great place to put your ads regardless and we're gonna talk a little bit about that today you know people are talking about them still they're watching them on YouTube and so we want to talk about what is the impact that the Superbowl has for ads today using some of the knotch research that measured these ads and the positive impact or negative impact that people felt about them so the first question I'm gonna ask is to start maybe you guys can guess if we missed 3000 people in our industry ranked the ads can anyone guess what was the number one ad don't be shy it's okay out of those twelve or all the ones that additively I guess so it was Amazon not everything makes the cut and next up was the Gillette we believe the math s men can be as a matter of fact all the ads measured mostly had positive impact and sentiment except for neutral was Pepsi more than okay bumble and bond and Viv the pitch of that was actually the only one that was negative oh I'm sorry that was the only one the last one that we just saw the mermaids I actually just realized this is like the third or fourth time I've seen and I just got the shark tank thing I didn't get I was so confused sorry okay but why do you think and maybe on D you can start that the Amazon and Gillette ranked so highly yeah well I think just at a high level this is from a personal standpoint as well as someone who watches a lot of the ads in this of the football I thought this year was really interesting because it felt like most of the brands played it safe there was a lot of neutrality actually in the sentiment that we captured even though it was property skewing towards positive I think last year we saw a bunch of backlash against some of the advertising that was put out there some of the brands were trying to take early a bolder statement using cultural trends and different borrowing from the past of different really great people in American history and their first sort of got in trouble on social shortly after so I think this year we saw a lot of the brands playing it relatively safe Gillette I don't think was actually on the Super Bowl but as you all I'm sure almost everyone here has heard about the ad before even walking into this room and I think really what's going on there is obviously tapping into a massive revolution that has happened over the last year I've heard very polarizing opinions from different categories of people I think women have had more positive reactions then men on average I think it also depends who Gillette was trying to kind of aim towards was it men of a particular type of belief men who kind of live in urban areas and have already been touched by a lot of the changes that have come with the me2 movement or was it a very different category of people so I think a lot of these questions actually pop up for me I'm kind of the token data nerd on the panel and I think when we talk about the Super Bowl what I've noticed is you know brands don't love hearing about data and measurement everyone wants to have a very strong opinion when it comes to whether it works or not and I think the bigger question for me which I hope we can tap into tonight is to figure out what brands does it make sense for what

### Segment 2 (05:00 - 10:00) [5:00]

type of campaigns is it a brand awareness is it a reach goal and then how do you really kind of follow up that on all the other platforms that matter as well which you know all the digital platforms how do you make sure that you're creating more than just this one moment in time and I'll give you just a quick example which I was recently approved to use I was having a conversation with the CMO of Denny's they did a Super Bowl ad a few years ago and they were offering some type of offer they managed actually to bring a ton of people into Denny's as a follow-up to the Super Bowl so there was like a very significant impact that they saw and they were able to deliver on the promise that they made and the Super Bowl ad but then every time the same group of people would go back to Denny's they you know would get a you know neutrals to negative experience because they actually haven't figured out by then how to scale the rest of the company to the traffic and the promise that the Super Bowl ad made so I thought that was a really interesting example of you know this is not just a once in a lifetime or once a year type of thing to do you actually have to be very thoughtful about how you use it and how it that integrates not just with the rest of your marketing but business so it's an interesting point because as I was reading some insights that journalists were writing about from the Superbowl advertising one thing that came out and Gary I'm gonna talk to you about this one is that many marketers are using social platforms to extend the Superbowl and a lot of advertisers pre-launch the commercials to build up one example that I thought was really interesting was that the avocado grows from Mexico they went to social to actually make guacamole like a Super Bowl item that you serve and they sold 50 8. 4 million avocados for the Super Bowl this year and that was before they even advertised in the Super Bowl so I mean this is a huge change then ten years ago and if you could talk a little bit about I mean I know you did a lot of work with planters and social impact before and after if you could talk a little bit about it how you think it's changed and what marketers can do to use social to really you know extend the life of their Super Bowl investment Thanks for having us so from my standpoint it's like why wouldn't you use tools that are available to you to drive your business so social to me is a slang term for the current state of where people spend their time on the internet which is all about attention right like what's the purpose of these ads like awareness or attention is that's the best part about the Superbowl right like you're gonna get consumption like to me it's why it's my favorite piece of advertising in the world like in the US excuse me like it is going to get consumed whether on YouTube the week before whether during the game whether the next day this is going to get consumed so that's exciting and then to not use social as a matter of fact I actually think brands should really consider not showing it on YouTube like for five years I was all about showing it on YouTube and now I'm wondering if for next year maybe they shouldn't because some of the surprise elements are being eliminated during the game and I'm just kind of like feeling like is this the moment tipping point where you want to pull back but it all leads to the biggest punch line which is these are businesses that are trying to drive business and this is one of the opportunities at their disposal but so is Twitter the week before and so is pre-roll YouTube the day of and so I'm fascinated by people's binary points of view on things it's obviously a mix of a lot of different things but this is a cultural event we're having an event a business event around it we don't do that for the Grammys or the Oscars or the NBA Finals so to me what do I think about I think anybody who doesn't have a robust strategy to do creative and media amplification on the platforms that dominate our mobile devices is in outer space in 2019 so you mentioned creative and yet I mean in this room I'm sure so many people created ads that they're so proud of yet there's a lot of ads in the Superbowl like I'm not sure if anyone saw the chunky milk by Mint mobile you know my family was so horrified and grossed out and just thought that was the worst commercial they ever saw yet people are talking about mint mobile so does creative really matter you know for the soup for the Super Bowl creative is the variable of success the end so yes it does the bigger question becomes does everybody talking about it mean people are gonna go buy it you know I think that the industry coming from the outside of growing up in you know retail and SMB and investing and now coming

### Segment 3 (10:00 - 15:00) [10:00]

to it talking about it or winning these awards or the rankings you know to me of somebody within all these companies actually cares about the business right and so I think yes creative is the variable of success did it inspire or make you think that you want to consider and then buy these products so I you know a lot of people know that I have a big passion for volume of content quantity which our industry believes means not quality which i think is silly but I've heard of the whole decade that I've been in this industry continue to preach that you know the creative is the variable so yes I do believe it I believe if you watch a commercial and you think that product sucks because of it that's bad Hey so speaking of great creative I love the bubbly Buble commercial and got such a chuckle out of it and Stacy here you know is one of the creators behind the commercial from PepsiCo so you know Stacy it's interesting because more than half of the pre submitted Super Bowl ads had celebrities in them including your bubbly Buble commercial yet you used humor do you think celebrity is the greatest driver of sentiment humor like tell us like what was behind your thinking in that and how those individual items celebrity humor really make your decisions and where you're going sure well first of all also I think creative is the utmost importance in this and we know when we look at mix modelling just to build on that last point two-thirds of all ROI and sales comes from creative effectiveness more so than even the media so it's hugely important that you know we feel like we have excellent creative at all times and I think to answer your question about the brand and about bubbly you know the first thing is what job are we trying to do with the Superbowl ad and so you know a Pepsi and a bubbly are doing two very different things for bubbly that brand has been around less than a year has relatively low awareness but he's really catching on and catching fire and people are talking about it and we said this is the moment where an inflection point we want to drastically increase our awareness but do so in a way that's consistent with the brand which built which is built on this idea of fun and playful instigation so when we were looking at creative we didn't brief in has to have a celebrity we didn't brief any of that we briefed what our objectives were what the brand is about and then the creative that best got the brand out told people what it was and did so in a way that was worthy of Super Bowl was finding a celebrity whose name happened to be very closely related to the brand name and so it was a little bit of a happy coincidence I think celebrity always helps in driving PR impressions talk value but we would never have done it at the expense of landing the brand message so as a follow-up question bubbly didn't have a lot of Verte eyes like you said or awareness prior to the Superbowl you went all in big with the Super Bowl where do you go from here we'll have a full year of support this year I'm bubbly so well you were using this as a launch platform we had a full campaign pre during and post around digital and social and a lot of different channels in fact during the Superbowl we had teams going out in a bunch of cities and putting sharpies on our products so that consumers could find Buble instead of bubbly the next day and so we had a lot of you know fun with it and going forward we're gonna continue to have you know a full year of marketing and advertising on this brand we don't want to have a boom splat where people find out about bubbly and then forget about it this is the beginning of a long journey and what kind of sentiment we're seeing in the social extremely positive was 15 to 1 positive to negative and it was called out in a lot of places as one of the winners from positive sentiment perspective that's great so onto according to Twitter 24 hours after the game the words boring and Superbowl were tweeted over 70,000 times and the words worst and Superbowl were tweeted together over 50,000 times so do you think that the circumstances of the Super Bowl itself affect the effectiveness of the ads and the Superbowl it does the research that you're looking at show a difference there yeah a hundred percent I think it influences the level of attention that people have when the brakes actually come in I think the level of emotional intensity is also just not there I think if you're in a mood where you're you know rooting for someone and you know you're very heated and talking with your family about it and then you see an ad that's great it just hits home in a different way and so yeah I do think that the fact that the game if someone was telling me on my team that it was the lowest score in history for the Super Bowl yeah the fact that it wasn't a very exciting game I definitely think made the overall advertising just not look as

### Segment 4 (15:00 - 20:00) [15:00]

exciting but I also think that the overall advertising just wasn't as bold as it usually is and so from a creative standpoint actually one of the things that I was wondering is to what extent the last two years of all these massive revolutions that deal with diversity to what extent has it made brands just be fearful about what they can say in his energy turn I think it's a good thing that a lot of brands turn to comedy and kept it light because at the end of day it is a football game but what does that mean from a creative standpoint how can you cater to everyone does that mean that you're basically not feeding to anyone in particular and what sort of campaigns is that good for so what kind of special considerations then I mean and you can all answer this I mean that NBCUniversal we have the Super Bowl every three or four years and we actually built an AI optimizer to help advertisers look at the creative and help them improve it so there are that you know we look at the creative itself do you use the celebrity do you use dogs or children those tend to sell really well the messaging how long do you keep your logo on the screen all kinds of things and help marketers drive impact what kind of considerations do you tell marketers to use I mean you can speak you all of you I think should ask answer this question you know it's interesting how you set up the question with dogs and children nothing gets more engagement on social than dogs and children and nothing sells less product for businesses than dogs and children so I tell clients a lot when we first start talking to them when they want to make engagement or other metrics that have nothing to do with their business as the KPI for our existence I literally look them dead in the face and go my ability to game that and be the greatest you've ever seen is so scary good but you probably won't see the business result you know that dogs and children don't sell well because one of the great things about how Vayner looks at things is because we have creative and media under one roof and the only KPI we trade on is selling weather DTC on Amazon or their own platform or doing massive holdout clusters in Walmart's or things of that nature what was unique about how our business was built was we weren't one discipline or the other I didn't know anything about the world when I started it and so because I was building it for myself with the hope of buying businesses and running through it our religion from nine years ago still to this day has always been business results and so when we look at in the beginning of my career when I would look at reports whether it was traditional reports or things like data logics that came along that helped Facebook justify when I was looking at internal MMMs and all these things were doing one thing but then the actual business was doing another and then the cliche answers of like because media and creative were split it was their fault or that fault it became a very interesting model as we get as we've gotten deeper into the process the beauty of Amazon and direct to consumer or the sophistication that happened as we built a big analytics and media department that allowed us to hold out you know regions stores locations with consistency over three years sales lives so when we look at testing Superbowl ads we look at we use blink Andover Brown and some of the same tools that we typically use and we look at all the same metrics and then we add viral potential just for Superbowl ads so still brand linkage and engagement and enjoyment are still the most important things but then we also add this as extra metric to make sure that it has talked value but we would never sacrifice brand linkage or anything else in favor of that if that makes sense and is there any research or sets that you have that marketers should consider when they're making Superbowl ads do you know it's interesting I think one of my friends companies newer inside was researching the I think 10 of the ads in advance and kind of helping with the creative pre-testing and as it turns out from both his work in ours what we see time and time again is that what's right from one brand is not right for another brand and so I mean I agree with what you're saying about dogs and although I do remember that the Budweiser puppy thing is you know I have a good feeling about Budweiser and I've never bought it but that's an issue yeah that is an issue I also I don't drink beer all of this but if there was a puppy next to a bottle of red wine I might have more favorably towards that I think many ways yeah what works for bran doesn't work for another brand and so I think it's not about trying to find ink our industries in general obsess with benchmarks and trying to find these golden nuggets that are going to transform your brand and that's not the case I think maybe if anything from a from both a personal standpoint and what we've seen from a brand awareness perspective is that the constant mention of a name especially when that name is not known is really important actually when my favorite ads from last year was the tide ad and if you remember it but basically it was just the funniest thing or you

### Segment 5 (20:00 - 25:00) [20:00]

kept thinking was this other ad but then it was a tide ad and they kept repeating that to you and I came out of that and again I guess I haven't bought tide but you know at least that also matters just think and I think what really is exciting for me is and look I'm a buyer of Super Bowl Phi like when NBC gets it again these were five million make it ten because I think they're really under priced and I think these done and I mean it I think I think they're grossly underpriced for the attention I really do when you look at the Delta between Super Bowl and then the next 10 most expensive ads whether it's the AFC NFC championship game the NBA Finals the Grammys the Oscars like they're expensive and yet nothing like this is gonna happen right so I think they're very under priced but I think the most important thing that happened so far in this talk for me is when you said I didn't buy it but maybe if that dog was next to a glass of wine it'd be more interesting there's something called Facebook and Google and YouTube and Twitter which actually has remarkable data to understand that you do have a propensity to like red wine or dogs or things of that nature and we can put those ads in front of you I'm super fascinated by the unbelievable capabilities of some of the modern platforms to do the thing that you just said that is the most true thing which is it has to resonate back to your point earlier what's really tough about television for me I am obsessed with the overall awareness spec to the names and things of that nature my favorite ad in last 10 years I've stumbled upon was a Versace ad where the entire ad is just people saying the word Versace like I'm a buyer of certain things like that but after this and what it does I'm so obsessed with the fact that we actually now do live in a world where puppy Redwine gets in front of you does exist and yet there's a disproportion and underestimation of what that actually means but I think what you're saying also taps into the fact that you know there's there segmentation when it comes to sending the right message to the right person and then maybe in the context of the Super Bowl given the fact that you're reaching so many people at the same time what you're really trying to do is either launch a new product or try to change your brand's perception but for anything else that's more targeted for stuff like tie that everyone already knows about like is it as effective would you pay 10 million for that you know somebody said to me Gary but we have 99% brand awareness already and I go an 8% relevance right like the reality is consideration to your point and I think you're making the right point the word that you know we use the word content so much and we don't use the word context enough right and I think a lot of where you're going is exactly right and so for me you know I'm just fascinated that one-and-twenty brought up the Denny's thing because that actually happened like 7 or 8 years ago yeah it was a while ago they haven't done it since and they won't again because their product sucks right like they've got like if you think about what they weren't able to deliver on they actually got people in so I've been like watching it for a long time too and I want to hear a wing that's relative if it sucks or not know the audience I think a lot of products that were on the Superbowl suck no the products suck because they were able to get a massive influx of users CAC but they weren't able to retain it LTB right yeah so they basically figured that out and said we can basically go back for scale until we figured this out internally yeah correct but what they did worked like to me what I loved about that ad and have for like the last seven to eight years is it worked it was more utilitarian which I loved about in which i think is a need within the Superbowl their unique issue to your point was the product didn't allow them to get the value in their LTV because of the product right a lot of things that happen in advertising or funny to me we win and we lose predicated on the actual thing there's a lot of people that are part of successes because the was phenomenal and the advertising was just fine the product was phenomenal so there's a lot to unpack there but I do think context is something that we need to talk more about and utility to Super Bowl I think is an untapped opportunity let's talk about so you know can you change people's opinions I mean the NFL they had the their ad for the hundred years the NFL I'm not sure if you saw that one it had so many players it was ranked number one by USA Today which is actually regular people ranking the Super Bowl ads do you think that they with all the controversy that they've had that ad has now changed the sentiment of how people feel about the NFL okay I think it helped and you know I think they have a long way to climb back from but what I liked about that ad besides the fact that I feel like it was a little cheating because I didn't have to pay for a hotel it'll be airtight everything and it was two minutes long but it was just fun it was what people like about football right it was fumbles and interceptions and throwing balls and people falling

### Segment 6 (25:00 - 30:00) [25:00]

down and all the talent that we all loved and that's what everyone's craving from the NFL not all the other baggage that has come with it this year and so I applaud them because I think they got back to what people want to see from them it definitely didn't change anybody's mind who's disproportionately overly passionate about the concussion issues the league as or the flag issues I you know no different than Gillette like one of the things that's so important about ads when things are going on in real life is understanding where people sit on issues right so like if you're a mother of a son who's got five concussions deep in high school and it's starting to deal with issues because of the sport of football that you're blaming for that ads doing nothing for you if you're somebody completely in the middle and kind of like whatever maybe it did move you a little bit and so I think that's what that's an important variable in those kind of things I think it's so hard to change perception with one thing especially one thing that air is doing your biggest event I think you have to try harder just and do it at scale and use volume as well as context throughout the entire year to get that done the other thing is I think we talk a lot about things and everybody here is a keyboard warrior and a real champion out there publicly on social media but then our actions are different right so like there's a lot of people that say a lot of things then act differently like NFL ratings did quite nicely this year because the games played out differently on prime-time like so I think there's a lot of there's the level of hypocrisy in our society is staggering and people are tough guys and gals on Twitter about products and services and then they spend their money in a different way so speaking of products and services Verizon they took a route of acknowledging first responders and then tying it back to the NFL do you think that made a strong impact for brand or did it get where people confused like how does this have to do with my wireless service basically yeah I mean I think some of those I think Verizon and t-mobile and auto I think a lot of those industries are really hard to land the what brand it's for I thought Verizon did a pretty did a really good job and I thought you know linking it to the NFL players and being contextually relevant made a lot of sense I'm not sure anyone like you know in a few months people are gonna remember that it was Verizon I think they'll remember the ad because it was a really beautiful powerful ad but I think it's right to Gary's point like unless you have cell phones all over these days I'm not sure it's landing a product message if you remember its fries and you might think more positively about it but first you have to remember it's Verizon I don't know so we work with almost all the big telcos I think residents the only one we don't work with yet so I can speak to the data itself but what I will say is that by and large almost all the other big tell cause aren't making necessarily this type of advertising there are law more focused on the innovation utility piece and the educational piece for what it's worth as a consumer I'm actually I've been exposed to a bunch of theirs their videos in the series and I've actually remembered that Verizon is the company that helps first responders pick up the call and for what it's worth it's made my perception more positive I think there's a long way to go now in terms of educating me why it's a better option but from a perception standpoint it's worked for me and I love the admin the thing I love the most about it is that it actually created a thread for me over time as opposed to just this one thing I think if it had been just one thing I agree with you I probably would have forgotten about it I didn't love it you know why didn't you love it I didn't remember it like I watched it again it came at the end like I just thought it was poorly executed like I hate things that happen at the end like the URLs that people are trying to send it to you like ESPN established just 15 years ago put at the bottom the whole time like you're asking people you know I don't know I just didn't love it and I also think look I'm always thinking about things like this of like what normal human being is like going through the process that we are right now none and so I'm trying to understand like do we become caricatures of ourselves because we're in the bubble and are analyzing it at a level that is just not real or is this us synthesizing what people are actually naturally going through but for me I didn't love it because I didn't remember it I didn't remember when it showed here and even the way it was executed I don't love the unveil at the end kind of thing and didn't pull up my heartstrings not that thrilled somebody's gotta be the phone service for First Responder I didn't know I think you hit on a really important point which is simplicity so I think when you have a lot of exposure to a campaign and you study it and he watch

### Segment 7 (30:00 - 35:00) [30:00]

it a few times it's different the vast majority of the hundred million people that are gonna see this have two seconds they look at it they might chuckle you know they might feel something in their heart and then they're on to the next thing and so keeping it simple I think could be really important yeah a vast majority is actually 99. 99% right but speaking of plenty at the heartstrings it wasn't one of the ads we show but the Microsoft really pulls at the heartstrings yet I'm not so sure that I was left knowing like what the product was like it had something to do with video games anyone want to comment on that I just think I consideration products are never gonna do that well at the Super Bowl I think low consideration products that need to get differentiated launched that need brand awareness are gonna be good but any high consideration product that has a longer sales cycle very tough so can I ask you a question on that yeah so those kind of items on regular TBC outside of Super Bowl I think again if you're trying to talk about the awareness or get the awareness it might work I think from a educational standpoint a dozen thirty seconds doesn't help with that I think you need a lot of content and to target it at the right people at the right time yeah that's why the awareness that's the thing I'm trying to work through which I appreciate I think that's exactly right like awareness and then I'm trying to understand the Delta of literally every other commercial but the Super Bowls ability to actually get awareness and actually be consumed not potential GRPs and so that's like an interesting concept of awareness in a medium that I mean it's scary for me to think what this audience let or anybody in America their behavior switches to amazon prime Hulu and Netflix as just where you consume period and then what's left over the last five years of commercials what's actually being consumed versus looking at your phone it starts getting to scary territory for me for the ability to build awareness but look at GoDaddy I like I just have to say like GoDaddy who knew about them before the Superbowl was there any GoDaddy in this year's Super Bowl like legacy expensive I tried and I was pumped at two [ __ ] Chainz was in the building but I'm not sure they pulled it off I would just go back to Microsoft for a second though cuz I don't know I wonder if you're making that ad if your objective is to really get people to understand what that product does or if it was a brand perception equity kind of driving thing that is then supported by other media that sells the actual product you know so if you know what made a lot of people feel something you know Microsoft doesn't often make people feel something the way Apple does so I think that my guess is it was more about trying to change their equity and change their perception a little bit not so much about trying to explain the product I don't know if this is just me but I think if you're trying to do that and trying to kind of aim at your you know millennial hipster I don't know if the Super Bowl is the best time to do that I almost feel like if you are at the Super Bowl you're not going to be perceived as a super cool brand that young people are going to embrace so if you're trying to sell a product towards that audience I think it's tough and again like Microsoft has great brand awareness I think when it comes to educating people and getting them to perceive you as a cool brand changing that perception I think you can turn to other places for less money and more Target that's just me I wasn't sure if I was getting the five minutes sign from the back she's not Lara do we have more than five minutes you giving you the five minute sign I saw you like holes up like that okay all right exactly there's QA will be coming soon so in your opinion if a brand is going to choose you know one thing to shell out is it celebrity licensing an iconic piece of music like Funkytown CGI god what else is there they could spend a lot of money on two minutes long commercial what would you choose Stacey what would be the thing that you invest it depends no it does I mean again I think it you know based on the development the creative development process and what your objectives are and what your brand stands for a brand like bubbly is always gonna lean on humor and will more likely use a piece of music or a celebrity or might use animation but it depends on the creative idea I think you do need something for Super Bowl but I think that something needs to be an excellent creative idea and then the bells and whistles that are around it should add to that shouldn't cover up something that's just not good to begin with so I mean I wouldn't I don't know I next year it could be something different than I would choose this year and nada

### Segment 8 (35:00 - 40:00) [35:00]

yeah I mean look if there was a formula for success I think marketers would be billionaires and we would be out of business as a data company I think you know there's different things that have worked for different brands at a high level the things that I've been saying throughout the panel is I would use it for brand awareness and I would try to mention the name a million times to make sure that people do stick with something even if it's a thirty Seconds thought and you know it takes someone like bumble I think if I were an innovative company I wouldn't necessarily turn to the Superbowl for this I think there's potentially a negative brand equity that you get amongst young people if you turn to the Super Bowl for awareness so that's just me two minutes you would spent the money on the two minutes in the way you asked the question yes I just think it's grossly underpriced attention and then to everything you're hearing up here the variable is the creative and the moment in time and the context I think that the price is very under priced mainly because of the reality of businesses I'm stunned by how much the biggest brands in the world are willing to spend on television outside of the Superbowl and I'd prefer them just by superbowl at scale and then take their dollars elsewhere in some of the context xual other channels that we've referenced so I think it's important to like not take it out of a silo of like what's actually happening out there and so is there's brands sitting there and saying ooh Superbowl is expensive let me just spend three point seven or five point seven through the year on television and I'm just deeply in belief that they are just getting absolutely no consumption of that and and they're getting no consumption in many digital places two programmatic banners and many there's an there's a stunning amount of money being thrown directly in the trash and I think Superbowl is not one of those places and I think current certain capability of the social platforms are not one of those places and then finding the creative that's contextual for those platforms is very important during this time the haves and have-nots which is why we're seeing so many brands decline because when you're wasting ninety five cents on the dollar you're gonna get in trouble good question do you actually believe that every brand could benefit from the Super Bowl like let's say Salesforce or not could benefit from the Super Bowl it's an interesting question I agree with where your macro statement is that there's a time and place like but I will say this I do believe that every brand can benefit from so the macro the answer your question directly in the way you asked it no I don't think every brand can however that gets in contradiction with my belief that it is so grossly underpriced that if they were to understand what to do with that time you know I think what we're trying to do is too much entertainment and branding back to utility I think that Salesforce if they ran their ad and said go to salesforce. com right now and fill this out if you're in b2b at all or we're introducing this thing like I do think the awareness which we I think we all understand has value is actually there like to me it's like it's crazy that it's actually they're sick I don't know if I mentioned this last year like five or six years ago I tried to buy a Super Bowl ad it was lab because I knew nothing about buying television and I it was very expensive for a human it was basically about as much income as I could have spent at that point in my life and I was gonna run an ad and it was gonna be a picture of my face like I was gonna make all I was gonna film it on my phone that was over like hey America it's me it's Gary follow me on Twitter yeah Ari Vee and be out and I remember like going through the logic of that as a human and saying like this is gonna be the best thing I ever do because it's going to work I'm gonna amortize out this attention and value over the rest of my life I think that the attention is so under priced in comparison to every other option in marketing that every business should challenge itself deeply to try to figure how about just using it as a first-party data collector like and I'm passionate about that go ahead I love your passion for the Super Bowl I would argue so much about television not be impactful because we have so much research that actually proves the opposite including ROI metrics that show how we can try and don't believe any KPI and not a buyer well thank God but we can have that conversation another time or here I think what people spend other people's money they spend it differently and so I think that you know I've empathy but I'm always curious what a lot of media buyers and executives would do if their actual children's health depended on that media spend versus what they do for a living and I think marketers are trying to find ways to be more engaging with consumers using the medium and a more powerful impactful way

### Segment 9 (40:00 - 45:00) [40:00]

content in context putting yourself around right you know brands that really marry your brand to a Content brand you know we've done so on fella that the outside of the Super Bowl would shoot big investments we've had our on the television side of the immigrations media integration so we have a big partnership with the Ellen show and we've had an eight-week slide in it's in show antennas in show and so together yeah I'm great people are watching that and then I love it that's where television started at Sullivan was brought to you by a town car company people watch things the format of a commercial by the way one of my favorite things that's happened in marketing the last five years back to your point countering my point is the way the television now what sports is splitting the screen that's been a huge coup like I believe that's a good move and so I think Sharon picture is a huge thing now is even in entertainment and we're able to do actually interactive picture and consumers are telling us they like that we're seeing it like in red carpet they want to see the behind the scenes of what's going on and you're right I mean we all have to get better at improving the commercial experience and things like you're doing with Ellen and integration opportunities are huge and important and there's things like the Super Bowl or the Academy Awards for the Grammys that are gonna thrive huge awareness and are around passion points that consumers love and you know whether it's like fashion of the red carpet around the Academy Awards or music and the Grammys or the whole pomp and circumstance around America I think we should talk about things like Instagram and Twitter 'z usage during sports and the grammys explodes during commercial time as a real data point yes like we like to your point like listen people have businesses and they're driving their thing and I've empathy for that but this industry is really silly when it talks about consumer centric because it's not its business centric to the kpi's of their businesses and I think a lot of that creates vulnerabilities that don't need to be there and I think if anything things like you know blockbuster are going out of business and Netflix and Sears and Toys R Us there's so many indicators that when you start doing things that are in your best interest in the short term financially that are against what's in the best interest of the consumer that eventually becomes a losing formula and I do think a lot of innovation on TV side would be a great idea sooner than later you have to do that to engage consumers so anyone want to say one final point before I toss it to the audience or QA Superbowl ads one final point Gary buy them make sure that it's the right choice for your pet that was creative matters great quality matters yes question yeah we'll repeat it you have the mic we can throw the mic and you do saying is that you have to know what you're doing the ad for what your goals are because our off is the only goal to sell product or is there a longer-term goal which there's an interplay between for better or for worse in social media that is well I think look these are businesses up here and there's nothing wrong with running a business and trying to sell product I think the best way to sell a product is they actually build a brand and not the sales centric you'd like to you know and so what I think superbowl does is gives you that potential to do the holy grand the best salespeople are the ones that built a brand and then let people come to them in perpetuity so and I do think the Super Bowl offers that so yes I think that's the goal but like obviously you know short and long term goals matter and this is what's so amazing I'm branding and marketing over D are selling and intent-based Google Ads it's you can actually build something that gives you longevity I actually am when I was saying that you should accompany that other digital assets like look social media is great I think it creates a lot of noise I don't love social media from Madiba collection standpoint no one does there's not a lot of room to truly understand your audience or to be able to harness that data in a strategic way for your brand so I think it's great to think about the higher level stuff and then with the kind of brand awareness campaigns but I think fundamentally you need to figure out a way to drive people back to your owned and operated properties you have to figure out how to have it there right conversation with your audience and that's really the only

### Segment 10 (45:00 - 50:00) [45:00]

way you can start driving towards sales at least in our world in the b2b world hi my name's Lee Nadler thanks for this discussion let's assume yes Superbowl okay one of the things that I thought was really interesting and I know it's a word that's thrown around is authenticity forget the celebrity for a second let's talk about like actually entertainment first product explanation I thought about life did some interesting things one was up there but the other ones that were up there with the corn syrup and so forth of trying to do it in an entertaining way but actually making a point about the product but two years ago I orchestrated the campaign for Mini Cooper called the five animals it was basically a program that had celebrities was entertaining when we looked at the merits and what is it that people are saying about our product and how do we define that with celebrities are actually also defined that label and had a mini my question really is and I don't think we touched on that when you look at something like Gillette okay the criticism that I heard and I could be debated either way and I'd love to hear from you guys on authenticity what was the problem that they had by either having the conversation or did they not have an authentic thing beyond just putting the conversation out there and I think it's really interesting to look at when you're going to make a big statement it's easy to say we don't have corn syrup and all that but if you lad is going to say you know we're the best van can be and we're going to do this and support women's issues in the lab and then they don't actually support the women's issues that becomes a problem and I just want to ask I guess a group about brands making statements that are in the social discussion and how authentic you have to be so I would say Proctor and Gamble is actually putting their money where their mouth is and are leading the charge with changing the way that women are portrayed in media and advertising with hashtag see how much bigger yeah sure so I think it could if right then I pray that could have been a Miss because people don't know that if you're not in our business and how do you then attach so that consumers know that you are doing good and you know it is tough I think to link together what you're doing versus making a big bold statement that they made and I can see that there could be a disconnect for some people when they watch that more pointed whether joanna or the others just people are going and they're going deeper they're going out to social they're doing research on the brand and what's the barometer for we're gonna make this statement and here's our back up for its real versus we're going to talk in a social conversation and just have the discussion I think you know the answer nobody likes somebody who's all talk and no action that's just something we don't appreciate hypocrisy is not cool and so I think yes it's a really bad idea to try to look the part and not back it up because people are looking for that vulnerability or our judgment levels on each other and businesses today are enormous Lehigh and so yeah I mean that's always been a bad idea that's no different than your product not being great right like so that's a different version of your product not being great yeah it's a book if you're gonna make the statement you've got to back it up and you know we America is an interesting place like we don't often mind the crime we mind when the person is trying to cover it up right like we don't like to be fooled and so yeah if a company comes out and is trying to make a big to-do but then their actions don't speak to that but that's happening every day I mean you look on the coasts the amount of people that talk about the environment but aren't willing to talk about that they're proud of that their clothes and textiles are driving some of the biggest damage in our society like we are one to two issue people and so like right and so even if you do it all right is it the right thing to be about that issue doesn't decide that as a for-profit business and I can't think having a purpose in the world is something that every brand needs to have but tying that purpose to a very hot social issue I think each brand needs to decide that's worth the risk and by the way did everybody see the Miller New York Times today I think the amount of people that saw Miller's

### Segment 11 (50:00 - 55:00) [50:00]

response versus buds move is an enormous Delta and I think that's an important thing for me you know I loved it I loved I'll be on the record saying I love it I think ads I think businesses need to do a little bit more of that I think it's a very poignant put it caught your attention that they were willing to even go there and I think back to like us being hypocrites we don't like attack ads in politicians yet it's very clear that it works and so you know I think in what I appreciated was it was an attack in a very you know kind of softer way I thought it was clever and like I think there's more upside I don't know how big the issue is pretty end consumer I'm just not educated enough on that but it definitely got the point across and back to why I believe in the Super Bowl man do I think very few people saw that print ad in The Times today at scale in comparison the Pepsi commercial we're coconut and like oh my god I love that you did it I don't know if you fancy does and that is a truth andhra bhavan you order a coke at a restaurant they say is Pepsi okay like that is something that is truly the world and bill said something about our brand but you know not everybody is and and that's and I think that's where we get to be like I don't know it's like the head honchos at Pepsi heard but most of us know Coke and Pepsi have some similarities like we're just so not consumer centric you know like I'm glad you did that affect me and so is that a more cost-effective way the leverage was super bold and I can't do a 5 to 10 million dollars I mean if you can't do the spot you got to do what you can do about it right I think one of the reasons a lot of times there are good holistic you know I used to always wonder when I first got in like why are people a little more 360 with their campaigns and that was because I didn't understand the dynamics of the creative agency landscape I didn't know that creative agencies thought everything besides TVC was [ __ ] and garbage and not of respect and didn't mean anything and ask their thoughts and so you know once I learned that then I understood I'm like oh okay they just completely disrespect it put no energy to it plus the media is a separate thing to begin with you know and the KPIs and you know we're not gonna buy that inventory because it doesn't achieve the low cost CPM that we have to hit to get bonus and so like real life takes over but that's a good idea you know and that's the punchline like the right things are being done because of the vested interest of partners within the reality of this business world for brands like jimsy - that sounds like a great idea I am disproportionally I mean that I mean disproportion believes that every brain in the world should do all the marketing in-house if they're capable to being dead [ __ ] serious the problem is that I've been hoping and catching it down i will never ever put my financial vested interest in front of being historically correct right cuz that's where I think people struggle and make big mistakes like the reality is if you're capable the problem for brands when you play it out is when the economy gets soft and Wall Street doesn't like all that overhead it helps to have so like there's all these real things but yes I think anything you can do better for a better price with better intent is a good idea when a streaming service such as Netflix or Amazon yes

### Segment 12 (55:00 - 60:00) [55:00]

the writing's on the rights right BISM yes we had CBS we have ABC Universal bidding you know getting the Superbowl and they're investing into streaming services well what happens when they're non-traditional get their hands on the Super Bowl in terms of how will that affect metrics we devised a question facts concert and general are we gonna see personalized content or easily why that advertisement invades so you know Gary said it before in terms of we have to look with consumer is going and we all need to work together as an industry to really change the ecosystem of how advertising works in the places that it's available and you also said you know you go back to the day-to-day realities of like I need to make my OCM when I did my PNL and the reality set in but the consumers aren't gonna stop moving the way that they're moving and so you know look there were pictures Bezos you know with well and is that something that could be scary but can they really continue to be non profitable and and make money just on subscriptions because a one-way revenue stream has proven that it will fail and that you need to a revenue stream with it with the price of content and you see someone like Facebook who's unwilling to get into the content game because their margins would go through the floor so it's really us working together I think as an industry to give consumers advertising because three out of four people who watch the Superbowl said that they were looking forward to seeing their commercials it is part of the pop culture conversation and they want great creative and they also want to be informed about new brands so I really think it's working together to make it better my take on that is three out of four sounds right and low intuitively but what about every other commercial that exists in the world what's the polling on that and when Amazon gets the NFL rights it's gonna come down to how they want to monetize it right to your point how long will Wall Street allow them to invest and when does the bloom cover off the rose and that becomes the question but once you have that much first party data and behavior nobody here I asked everybody here to ask themselves how much they're willing to pay for Amazon Prime versus what they're paying now well Hulu when they offered the 99 cents for an ant load most of the subscribers took the ad load so because who's one-dimensional right and who's one-dimensional one more time how much is everybody willing to pay for Amazon Prime which delivers all your products I'm talking about actually but some prime the [ __ ] that everybody here has to buy everything they buy you know I mean that's that like what we're having is we're having siloed conversations and when amazon has last mile and you can order toothpastes and get it in 24 seconds in your door I think we're having a naive conversation and when the entire guys if the terrorists attacked Amazon's infrastructure for the internet the whole internet would collapse everybody is on the infrastructure so like there's a lot of leverage points that Amazon has that we are that we have to factor into this because they have leverage everybody here would pay a lot more for prime because the value of free delivery across all the products and service they buy is enormous and that is just that's just real life and they'll be interesting to see then I don't know how much more are we willing to pay for that core service that is so important they'll a layer on top of it and so I mean they have a lot of leverage and we did it like super old one wasn't even sold out like the ads on Joe Louis's fight on the radio were a fortune in the forty like this is not that long ago like we're always gonna move to where the attention is the question becomes the ad formats the reason I love the Ellen integration is that's good you're consuming that like I think brands should be spending way more integrating into the actual content and how networks decide to do that and things of that nature I mean Amazon might come out and not have commercials or who knows but like what Amazon has is something that nobody else has when they have the NFL rights and you're watching your game and a player scores a touchdown and you're excited and the friction of you being

### Segment 13 (60:00 - 64:00) [1:00:00]

able to know that because something just happened during their game that if you just say Alexa order me a Sam Darnell juicy it's discounted because they're playing they're eliminating friction they're gonna make revenue in a way other people haven't we're not yeah but like but do you know what I mean like they're eliminating for like you're watching a football game something good happens you're a die-hard fan and you're aware now through the marketing and branding that you can just buy that product through voice like the what we do all the time is we make binary decisions without understanding the other variables that this infrastructure is creating that's gonna make them highly profitable their contents valuable to them they sell [ __ ] and he see an ESPN don't I think it's really important to also remember that a few years ago we're talking about Facebook exactly the same way I think there's gonna be a lot of ethical issues that come into play consider this idea that Amazon's taking over the world and they're going to use their servers to and the alexis is gonna fully integrate the and in a really creepy way completely change our lives I think potentially you might have some checks about isn't it the government gets involved when somebody wins too much yeah but I think it's even more than that I can do wonder what the evolution of Facebook is going to be in a world where the consumer is becoming a lot more vigilant about what's happening with their data well if you look at instagrams behavior we you know the answer is we go where we value things right a very different thing Instagram versus Facebook and the brand awareness around the issues of Facebook for some reason don't relate to Instagram for now I think you might because hypocrisy is cute just really quickly say something I think that there's an element of me seeing that and feeling like I discovered it and there's something really special there about it versus feeling like someone's read my mind and has put that into my plate in the way that feels really creepy and intrusive I am one of the to two to five percent of people who actually care about other data is being used because I just know too much about it but I would say half the people don't care I think that might change with time and regardless it doesn't matter because if I were some of the people care enough they're going to change the way everything else works also consumers are moving the way that they view traditional linear television content in a digital format whether it's a Roku or you made your app and so they're those products of data and you're gonna see a huge shift of being able to do addressable linear television like you've never been able to you before the technology is now catching up and consumer Nader so I think it's really exciting times for all of us but again we have to protect the consumer and give them their privacy and be responsible with what we do and I would like to add that Jeff Bezos did say that television advertising was for the most powerful vehicles and he wasn't a fan and changed his mind in the last year because he started to invest heavily and see how it was driving sales and usage so I think using fear as a sales tactic is interesting and I think that is like an important like seriously I think it's a really important like I think it's interesting like first of all everybody just has opinions right and then things play out and I have I value massively people that have different points of view and think massively I just I think that there's ideologies around human beings that historically humans haven't delivered on and so that's what I'm trading on but this may be the singular issue and that's fine and you know I think that's great hey guys thank you so much for watching my video on YouTube I wanted to jump in here at the end because I'm working on a ridiculously important project for me and I have a funny feeling you can help if you drink wine at all or know anybody that drinks wine at all please go to empathy wines calm right now and sign up for a subscription whether it's a three pack whether it's a six pack or whether it's a whole case of each for the year if you drink 36 bottles of wine a year or give away please sign up for Club empathy this project means the world to me that could really use your support