We asked Hollywood Editors

Today I'm talking to the editor of Frankenstein, the co-editors of Predator: Badlands, and the editor of Conjuring: The Last Right to pick their brains on their editing process. I'm constantly trying to level up as a director and editor, and these guys have some insane knowledge about the craft of storytelling. And one of the biggest perks to Film Riot is that it gives me an excuse to reach out to talented friends and talk to them about these topics, both to share with you and for my own selfish gain. So, let's jump right in with some editing tips. The first thing I asked all of them was, "What is the first thing that you do when starting to cut any scene? " — If I have time to watch all of the dailies before I start cutting, then I'll do that. And then it becomes sort of a little bit of like winnowing down what I actually do have time for. So, if I don't have time for the full dailies, then I'll watch just the selects. And if I don't have time for the full selects, then I will pick one, you know, probably usually the last full take of any setup and I'll watch that just so I get a sense of like, okay, this these are all of the angles and all of the movements of the camera that I have access to. And then that helps me start thinking in my head about like, okay, this is an in for the scene I need. This is a great shot in the middle of the scene and this is how I want to end. — I watch all the dailies first and really just kind of hone in. Usually it'll be like, oh my god, that was great. You know, that thing was great. that moment was great and that becomes sort of the foundation for the scene. It's like I know I want to use that. I got to use that now. If I'm going to use that, how am I going to build to it? Or, you know, if it's not the beginning of the scene and or it's the end of the scene, how am I going to get to it or how am I going to come off of it? — I will revisit the script. Um, I'll quickly reread the scene. I'll also look at script supervisor notes just to get any idea if there was any preferred takes or anything that the came from set. Then after my assistants organize my dailies, I have them usually quickly put together all the takes in one sequence laid out in shot order from take 1 to 10 or whatever in a camera, B camera, back to back. And um I'll watch it all. I'm looking at like, oh, this is an amazing keystone shot that I know that we're going to use or the most perfect performance that's going to be like I'm going to build it out from there and try to get to a quick assembly that I can then start even hunting and pecking for better pieces. — And that idea of a keystone moment when starting in on a scene came up with everyone. Many of them mentioning how they would start with a standout moment from the dailies and work from there. I don't work completely backwards, but like yeah, you find like a really compelling piece of dialogue or like performed like strong and you're like, you know what, I'm going to go to the mat for this shot, this piece, and then yeah, you kind of build on either side and work your way out. But I do find that how you start a scene really does dictate how it becomes. The first shot you pick, I actually think has way more importance than people realize because it becomes this weird keystone foundation brick that you've laid down that like I've just picked because I'm by myself editing, directors out usually shooting during that time. You're hoping that you've picked correctly and that your foundation is strong and then you just build off of that. — I don't think I've ever done this building from a standout shot or moment, but it makes complete sense and is something that I will be trying going forward. And when I was talking with Stfan about getting a scene together, he really emphasized the importance of sound, even in the early cut stages. See this guys? $20. Ryan just sent me this. That's why I'm here. I think sound is a super important thing for presentation. was certainly less important in the past, but now when we're doing playbacks or, you know, when I'm trying to pitch an idea, the closest I can get it to sound finished, picture is never going to look finished. But sound, you can you can, you know, you want to cut off these avenues to it feeling wrong. You want to say like, okay, well, the sound's not messed up and the music is doing what it needs to do and stuff like that. Or it's the mistake, I'm sure, that you encounter. We were talking about this earlier. You encounter where people do a short film and it looks great and it's like the sound is messed up. You're like, "Well, you don't know that that's like just as important, if not more. " So, I look for ways to just like what whatever you're working on, finding ways to push it as close to finished as possible. And I found that is sound and music and mixing. And speaking of the importance of sound effects and music, today's sponsor can help with that. Epidemic Sound is an excellent platform for music and sound effects. All rights are included and everything is restrictionf free, which means you don't have to worry about copyright claims and can just focus on creating. They also have over 50,000 premium tracks made by real artists and over 200,000 sound effects. So, you have a ton of options to choose from to fit whatever project you're working on. Be it an edit you're passing off that you want to get as finished as possible, like Stefan said, or the final product started and finished alone. 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Usually, like sometimes it's the scene itself is not working because it's not fitting into the puzzle right, you know, yet. It uh, you know, there's something that happened before that isn't reflected in this scene or there's something that's coming after that this scene isn't setting up right. And that's sort of, you know, how you're kind of molding the scenes within the bigger framework of the movie. So, I don't know that there's like a trick or anything, but it's sort of like going through all the footage again and finding out why those moments aren't landing the way you thought they were when you were initially assembling. And usually the answer is because, well, it didn't it wasn't set up right earlier and or it didn't pay off later. And how do we change that? or the tone of a character because that tone in that scene doesn't fit what he was or she was doing earlier or later, you know, — if it's not working for like a character reason, then I start diving into like alternate takes to see like maybe if I if it's like an unlikable character or that something about the performance isn't jelling, you know, then you have to go reassess those decisions you made when you first did the assembly. And often you can find, you know, variation in an actor's performance and pick something new or pick a, you know, either one new take that you sprinkle throughout the whole scene or a variety of takes that support changing the feeling of that scene for that character. But yeah, it's often sort of diving in and seeing like what do I have in my dailies that is different than what is currently in the cut and can I use that? If I can, I like to just stick with one take. And I think having talked to some actors that didn't exactly like realize how much their performances can get chopped up in editorial, I know the actors prefer that also because then at least like there is a continuity that you can feel in that where if you can pick like one base take that's like this I love, you know, if it's not 100% I love 90% of the performance in this take and maybe there's a couple of moments where you steal from a different take. But I think you can feel if every time you cut back to an actor you're on a different take. I think you can feel that. And so I try to just stick with, you know, the fewest number of an actor's takes as possible. Second to that, you can decide, you know, when you're going to be on an actor and off an actor. And sometimes, you know, the looks, an actor's looks responding to somebody else's line can be just as powerful as like seeing that line on camera. And so those are, you know, your really kind of your big choices to make is like when am I watching a character speak and somebody listen to a character speak? hunt for and cherish amazing reaction shots. Don't ever underestimate just somebody listening to what's happening or they give them a line read and then stay on them and let them like feel the response of what they put out into that scene or into the universe that they're, you know, living in. I think staying on actors faces, their eyes, letting people listen and take in information. Not only do they let you tighten scenes up and trim because you can cut away to them, but they have so much more weight when it comes to performance from my experience. — And all this made me think about production as a director when I'm getting my coverage. What are some things that I'm not thinking about that would help fix some of those problems in post? And Stefan had some amazing tips on exactly that. When I walk in, I exist in quiet. in no less than 45 minutes. — Yeah. Like what the what were you asking about? Give me entries and exits. I don't care what the scene plan is. Like give me a character entering or exiting. You never know when it's going to be helpful. I also always ask when we're doing a dialogue scene for coverage that's not tied to the character's faces. I find this is the most helpful material because actors act with their whole bodies and I mean it's trickier obviously with L since she was half a body but you never know what actually be doing with their hands or their feet. It's good to have that kind of insurance so that we can cover the scene off of the actor's faces. I would say uh knowing things are going to change in post-production in editorial. One great thing to do is once you've locked down a

scene, the dialogue scene specifically, once you've got what you need and you feel like you can move on, shoot the scene again with no dialogue, and have your actors act out the scene. You know, you're tracking emotion, but there's just no dialogue. And I've found that to be so helpful. It's like glue. It's all of a sudden you have this kind of Elmer's glue to work with where if anything goes wrong in the scene, you got to lose a line of dialogue or rewrite maybe you realize in doing this you don't need dialogue, but you have the kind of emotional material that you need. I mean, just do it. It's great. Useful in ways you can not predict. The no dialogue tip might be my favorite of the entire episode. Maybe it's not something I would do every time, but picking up for the scenes that could use it is just genius. And I could see how that would really help with something like building tension inside of a scene since for me a lot of tension is found in those prolonged moments or silences. — Sure. I mean, you know, there's tension and then there's jump scares. And um, you know, I guess that's sort of like the tension just like any comedy. It's like the setup and the punchline, you know. This is like tension's just like the buildup and then the jump scare, so to speak. To me, it's just remembering that what you don't see, what the audience doesn't is withheld from is the most important piece of information that creates the tension. You know, if it's something down the hall and you kind of tease that there's something down there and then you're hanging on the person's face, the longer you stay on that person's face and don't reveal what they're looking at, the more you're imagining what's going on back there, the audience, the more the tension builds. So to me that's the number one thing. I mean it's the same thing in a dialogue scene. You know if two people are having a conversation but like you knew that like under the table somebody had a gun pulled that whole conversation is tense and it could be just them talking about ordering scrambled eggs. You know what I mean? But like you know and so like you set up something and now you've withhold what's going to happen. to me. Like I think hiding the thing the most and staying with the perspective of the character that you're invested in is usually my number one tip. — And all of this revolves around pacing. And I would say along with sound, pacing is what I always have the most notes on whenever newer filmmakers send me their work. It is something tough to get right. So I asked Evan not only how he finds the right tempo for a scene, but how he sticks to it. you know, my assemblies are also very airy, you know, and you know that because it's easier to cut time out than it is to add it back later on. I usually start with just sort of, you know, how it feels in a very dry assembly state and then as you get the rest of the film, you know, around it, you inevitably feel like, okay, this is now too slow and I need to start pacing it up. I liken it to like a ratchet, you know, where like you just like you tighten that scene and it's okay for a second and you tighten it again and you keep going, you know, until you lock you. You can definitely get to a point where you've cut too much air out. For me, it's a very physical reaction where like I'm watching something and I can feel my body tense up if like it's too cuddy, you know, it's too fast, the characters lines are all on top of each other, you know, I've like I've overcorrected in that case and then it's going back and, you know, adding some moments back in and some error and some, you know, meaningful pauses and things like that. Your judgment has to change as the film changes. And so, you know, a scene could have exactly could be exactly the same as when you did the assembly and feel too slow in the assembly and too fast later on or vice versa, you know, and it just really depends on what's, you know, what you're looking at and how the film has evolved. I love what he said about tensing up. I can totally relate to that. But eventually, you've seen this thing that you're cutting over and over again, and I find it incredibly hard to maintain an objective lens on the project. Everyone here had the same great tip of making sure you're showing your work and getting feedback from fellow filmmakers and general audience viewings. But Stefan said something extra that I hadn't thought of before. I mean, this is the thing I ask every day and kind of the biggest challenge I think daily. So, how do you retain perspective? For me, having a partner is a great way cuz I constantly have Dave's ears to play against his ears and eyes. And then you have your extended team, which is this other kind of circle of objectivity where uh I can have a sequence and I hand it off to our incredible sound effects team and they bring it to life in a way that I wasn't counting on or imagining. So it's going to feel totally different. That's how I retain objectivity is like the people around you. Letting the people around you do their jobs and letting you, you know, watch effectively a different version of the movie through the work of other people. That's the benefit to having a big team like we did on this film. — And to finish it off, David and Stefan shared one little trick that they do in their timelines that I will absolutely be stealing from here on out.

Something that I learned on this film on Predator um from uh the other editor Stefan, you can put an effect on a track, an audio track, uh of reverb, and rather than it you putting the effect on the clip, you can put it on the whole track. Tanya Swirling is an editor I met years ago. She cut Clooney's last two movies. She's incredible editor. I love her. She taught me this great trick that now I use all the time, which is I have dedicated sound effects tracks that are treatment tracks. So, I'll have dialogue effects like built into the sequence. So, I have a reverb track for sound effects and music. And it allows you to quickly have things ring out, a piece of music that didn't end properly. You can make it ring out over the next scene or whatever. It was some convoluted way. I used to do these reverb bringouts that was like subcliffing and do doing all these technical things and now just in the track it's just like oh there it is you know there I want that to reverb I just bring it down to that track and it'll reverb out — you know it softens everything cleans up any bad audio and that was from Tanya swirling man those are handy little tidbits handy little tidbits for all of us but that's it we do have some extra nuggets of wisdom from the guys that we're going to be posting to our Instagram and other socials over the next 2 weeks. So, check the links below and follow us there for that. And a massive thank you to Evan, Elliot, David, and Stefan for taking the time out of their schedules to share their hard-earned knowledge with us. And check below for links for all of them there as well. And I'll be leaving you with one more thought from Stfan. So, until next time, don't forget to write, shoot, edit, repeat. If the people you're working with every day, if you do not enjoy those people, that is the most important check box. Not everybody checks that box. Not everybody can check that box, but I check that box. It's more important than anything else for me cuz the box that should be automatically checked is like are we trying to make a great thing. If you don't feel confident about the answer to that question, you're certainly working with the wrong people. Right? So that's just a given. We're all trying. We won't always do it, but we will always try to make something great. But the most important box are like, man, I'm going to be with these people all the time. So are my days worth it? And um certainly that is the case with this team like we had the best time working together and we have consistently you know but that's unusual but it should be the thing that we all seek out you know — see you later talk