How Terry & Lampard's Toxic Mafia Broke Managers: John Obi Mikel

walking into that dressing room and seeing all those players, those massive, massive names, the ego they had, they will bully you, those guys. — There's players piling in there. — Absolutely magnificent. The players, they deserve this. It was a mafia kind of dressing room. Our dressing room back then. It was a It was run by guys that if you are not tough enough, they will just put you in your place straight and they will keep you there. You have to be strong. The togetherness that we had back then was absolutely fantastic. And that came from Jose Mourinho, John Terry as well, who's the leader. That straight away makes you, you know, tells you the culture of the football club. club is what we never forgot back then because the culture of Chelsea was winning games, winning trophies, being professional, sticking together no matter what. We don't let outsiders break us. No, the togetherness that we had. Yes, we can lose a game. Yes, you can criticize one of us, but we were always together. JT was absolutely fantastic at that. If you get criticized, he comes in the next day. He reads the papers. He comes and puts his arm around you and tell it's okay. — It's okay. We are behind you. I am behind you. You have to go out there the next weekend and show them what you can do. But in around this club, we are with you. We stick with you. We will never You will never be alone. If you have a bad game, if you get criticized, you will never be alone. And that came from Mourinho, John Terry, Frank Lampard, the core of the squad. Peter Czech, Ashley Cole, these guys were always there to support you. And there's no better colleagues that you want to be accepted likes of JT. JT was, you know, JT rule, you know, he buzzed the place. He was, you know, it was his club. Everything went through him. If a manager comes in and thinks, okay, you know what? I know you have way too much power and I don't want you to have that much power. I want to cut some of those powers. Straight away we sense it. He senses it. JT straight away senses it and okay. All right. I think we're going to have there's something is going to happen here and eventually he wins. You know what I mean? You can't come in straight away and say, "Okay, you know what? I know you have way too much power. " Like Andre Villa's boys who knew us back in the day when he used to work for Jose Maria as a an analyst came in took over and said, "You know what? You Frank Lampard, you're not going to play anymore. JT, I'm gonna in and out, and I'm not going to tell you why you're not playing. You can't do that with players like that. — So, when that happened, what did those players do to make sure that they weren't the ones that left? It was Vaspos was the one that ended up leaving. — Oh, they know how to manipulate the whole place, aren't they? It's all about manipulating the players that we're playing and trying to because when they walk in and they're not happy straight away it just uh goes around the whole place. You know when player like John Terry's not playing, Frank Lampard is not playing, DJ Da is not playing, they know how to manipulate the younger players, the players that are playing, you know what I mean? With their attitude, with their with their mood and you are playing, but you're looking at the people that you looked up to, they're not happy. Sometimes I cannot play with the whole environment and then they start negativity start creeping up. You lose a game and then they all walk in the next day in the training ground and you see that they're not happy and Vas Bos is trying to tell you what to do but you're looking at John Terry with his sad face. Frank Lampard standing there with his sad face thinking we should be playing. Negativity start creeping in. You know the place is not settled. You can feel the tension. And then once it starts going bad, it starts going bad because there's no coming back from that because the only people that can get you back from that — are those guys that you frozen out and they're not going to help you anymore. When you go back to them to try, they're not going to help you. It's too late and then you're gone and that's how they win. — It's insane, isn't it? Because the manager has to manage the club. But he can only manage the club if the players allow him to manage the club. — Exactly. But he can't do that anymore because he's lost the main guys in the dressing room. — It's about balance though, isn't it? Because you want to create the kind of culture you had at Chelsea where the players like created this fierce, aggressive, dynamic winning mentality. — Yeah. — But if you give them that much power and that much ability to control the mood around the place when things are going wrong, they also have that power at the same time. — Exactly. To help you. — Yeah. — And the best person can make you or break you. — Yes. The best person who did that was Skylangelotti. Explain. Carlo came in and he knew straight away Carlo has won everything. Massive, massive name. Came in and he knew that I need these guys with me. I have to have these guys with

me. So he made friends with John Terry, Ashley Cole, Frank Lampard, Pet DJ, but he had these guys with him. This was these were his guys and he knew that I cannot take the power away from these guys because I do need these guys. So there was a time during the season when even when we won the league things were not going well and I could remember they were having he was when things are not going well you know we won two three games and we lost one or two for us back then when we lose two games in a row was crisis — it's crisis but now it's allowed to lose two three four games at Chelsea and it's okay we'll talk about that — it's not okay because back then it's crisis so when we do that and we lose to two games in a row and then yeah things are not going well it is crisis And then he goes in, we can hear that we when you come into the training ground, we can hear there's a meeting going on. So Ka is having a meeting with the big boys. So they in having meetings. So and then we know that and were you never in that group? — No, I was never in that group yet. — Why not? — Because I wasn't fully accepted back then. It was the likes of JT, Frank Lampard, DJ Drogba, Petek. this were the back this were the backbones of the you know of the club and this were the guy that they guys that they have meetings with the managers had meetings with so then when JT then comes out then he has his group of people that he has meetings with that's where I'm sort of part of that group uh but the manager has maybe not a lot of people one or two three four players that he has meetings with and then once he comes out after that meeting you can feel that the big senior players they've come out with a renewed energy and then you And then they during training they go around talking to the players. You can see that. — What was training like? — Oh, training was intense. Our training was intense. — Was it? — Yeah. Players kill each other because listen, we all competed. We all wanted to. — There was two three players in every competition. Uh in every position, — you know straight away if you don't play well this weekend, you're out of the you're out of squad. first 11. So the competition was always there in training. The tackle were flying. You know, players think, okay, if I get you injured, then I might be the one who's playing. I don't think that's what it was, — but the tackles were flying in. You know, there was fight, you know, happening during training. Players, you know. Yeah. There was blown out like real like proper fight. Yeah. During training. Yeah. During training, you know, — between who? For example, — I remember one Michael Balak had a fight with um Solomon Khu. Solomon Khu was a guy, very quiet guy, lovely, lovely boy. But Michael Balak must have done something that day to really game off. He went off. I think we played the game and yeah, we played the game. So it was the next day training. So players who didn't play were training. I was already inside. I think I did play the game. So I was already inside just doing a warm down and stuff and then one of physio riding. I was like, "Oh, there's a fight going on. A fight just happened. There was Solomon Ku and Michael Bak. " And everyone was thinking Solomon Kaloo of all people, how did that happen? So yeah, I just think we don't know what happened, but I just think Michael Balac must have done something that has gotten Solomon Kaloo to go off — and fists were flying. — Yeah. Yeah. A proper fight. They had to be separated. They have to be pulled away. And um and Michael as well, when you look at M, he's a massive unit. And for Kaloo to go up to him and square say, "Listen, okay, let's have it. " He must have done something really to get him going. And Solomon K is a very good friends of mine, the callers brothers. So when he came in, I was trying to ask him what happened. He was still at it that he couldn't speak. He didn't tell me what happened. He was so angry. He got into the shower, showered, and left and went home. He didn't speak to anybody. So that was how the intensity were back then. Um I don't know if they have that right now, you know, at Chelsea. — You know, something happens when you hit your 40s. you actually start to realize that the scarce thing in life isn't ambition anymore. It's actually time. And between running businesses, hosting this podcast, trying to be present as possible with my kids and my family, there is only so much of me to go around. Which is why I've been thinking more and more about how to make things in the background work a bit harder for me. And this includes my money. And this is where XTB comes in. XTB have launched a cash iser and stocks and shares ISA where new customers can currently earn 6% interest which includes a 2% boost for the first 90 days. You get taxfree growth, daily interest, flexible withdrawals, and no account management fees which means that your savings can grow while you're still staying accessible. And if you open an account and make your first deposit within 7 days, you'll also receive a free stock to start your investment journey. If you want to learn more, just go to xtb. com/en/join/highperformance and use code HPP when you sign up. So already the place was already calm when

Carlo came in. But through the season, there was a time where we had, you know, bad situations, you know, we were not winning games and that's where those meetings happened and Carlo was the best at that. You know, he knows how to bring the the team together. His management was the best. You can talk to anybody that's played on the color Angelotti. I don't think there's one person that will have a bad word to say about the guy. — Give us an example of how he managed to do so well. — Just never shouts to players. — Do you remember your first conversation with him or how he made you feel? — My first conversation, we had a group conversation. You know, when managers come in, they have like a group conversation like in the dressing room. They say, "Listen, I'm here. I know things were not going well with the current with the past manager or you know I'm not here to change much. I'm just here to speak to you guys. I I'm going to respect you. I want you guys to respect my decisions and when I make decision you're not playing. I want you some managers say my door is open. Some say don't come and speak to me because I can't explain to you why you're not playing. You have to show me in the training ground. But Carlo was like listen if you're not playing you can speak to me. I will never come to you to explain to you why you're not playing. If you feel the need that you want to know the reason why you're not playing, then you can come to me. But if you're waiting for me to come and explain to you why you're not playing, I will never do that. It's your responsibility. If you want to play, if you feel disappointed that you're not playing, — did you ever go to him? — Yes, I did. I did. I have conversation with him. Um I think when he came in, I was playing. So there's a time when I had a little bit of a dip. and then I felt I was back at it again. But then still I wasn't getting picked and then I went up to him. I was like, "Listen, why am I not playing? " He's like, "Listen, you're a big part of this group. I want you at the club and I want you to stay, but I just think right now because you had that dip. So the guys who were playing, they're still doing well. You know what I mean? So it's going to be hard for me to just bring them out. So you just wait. Keep training doing what you're doing. I can see you training well and I like that. continue do what you're doing. If a situation come by that they're not playing well again, of course you're back at this squad. But knowing me and being part of being there for such a long time, I felt like I I've end the ride that I was playing well and now I'm not playing well. And now that I feel like I'm back at it again, I want it back in the squad. But then when he explains that to you, there's nothing else you can do. You just have to wait. And that was the situation. And you just have to continue to compete in training and and keep putting in the hard work. There was no my thing about Chelsea Football Club all my years at the club is the only place where you can show that you want to play week in week out is in training. Is in training and training was very intense. It doesn't matter what manager came in. Training was very intense. Sometimes the manager doesn't set the tone of the training. It was the players. It was John Terry. You're playing faf aside. He wants to win. Whatever you're playing, He's tackling. He's jumping. He's screaming in training. He's shouting at players if you're not training well. He tells you to go in if you don't want to train. If you're grumpy, you feel you're not playing. He sometimes takes responsibility. And that's what the managers that come in have seen that, okay, this guy, yes, this is my captain. Because if John Terry speaks to you, you have to